Divorcing and Narcissism are a difficult combination.
A narcissist in divorce will test your strength. Be prepared.
Are You The Victim Of A Liar? This Cut To The Chase Guide Is For YOU
Divorce is never good - but take a narcissist/verbal/emotional abuser and his lawyer and you have a situation that can turn quickly into an explosive battle. You can be hit with increasingly intense abuse. The legal system can be a very effective battering tool.
Learn how to navigate these waters. Be prepared. If you have not yet begun the process of divorce protect yourself by careful planning. One woman asked if people listened about the importance of planning. I told her some do and some don’t.
She said, “Tell them I am the poster child for not planning and it isn’t good.”
Before You Begin To Divorce A Narcissist
This is a dangerous time. In times of danger the best thing to do is prepare.Men are used to doing battle. Women are not. But men are easy prey for emptying their bank account by greedy lawyers. I wrote in my book about divorce:
The first thing my husband’s attorney asked him was “Shall I hit her over the head with a 2×4?” There is such pathology in this that we must be aware, vigilant, and prepared. The legal system is adversarial and full of men and women with tremendous needs for power.
We are dealing with narcissists who are already damaged and primed to do battle.
PLANNING is CRITICAL!
If you have a lot of money, your tactics will be somewhat different than that of one with lesser money. But everyone has something to protect. There will be no mercy shown by your narcissist during this time. His sense of entitlement is boundless and you will be maligned and disparaged and anything, any crumb you get will be too much for you. In his mind, you are worthless, you deserve nothing.
Plan. Plan. Plan. Today, that means be careful with social media. Here’s how attorneys use it in divorce:
Make sure you have access to all the family funds and accounts. Unless it is an inheritance or there is a prenup, family money belongs to both of you. If you are not on title of the house, make sure you do this.
Get a support group of therapists, friends, family members. Make sure therapists understand narcissism and can testify in your behalf in court.
If the therapist is good but resists the words narcissist and narcissism, call it emotional and verbal abuse.
Do not discuss impending divorce. This gives him time to drain the bank accounts, change documents. When you hire a lawyer, do not tell your spouse immediately. Tell the lawyer your situation. Ask if they can handle tough cases. Make sure you interview several lawyers. Ask who the “pit bull” lawyers are so you can interview them. That way, even if you do not hire them, neither can your spouse.
Negotiate the retainer. Most family law attorneys overcharge. Try and find one that gives you some breathing space in terms of how they charge. The more prepared, calm and efficient you are, the more the attorney will respect you. Emotion and long stories are not liked by attorneys. They are busy, they want cut to the chase information – are there custody issues? is there property to be divided? how much? what problems do you foresee?
Planning is never so important as in divorce. Get your ducks in order and do all you can and be prepared before you announce you want a divorce.
If that’s too late, then begin getting support group together. It is never too late to hire evaluators or therapists for your side. If custody will be an issue, be prepared that he will try to alienate your child from you with brainwashing. Learn as much as you can before you divorce.
It won’t be easy, but it will be worth it.
{ 33 comments… read them below or add one }
Really informative article.Really looking forward to read more. Fantastic.
I agree with Ms. Cherelle, great article with hitting the nail on the head. I’ve been divorced for four years and the hatred and attempts at manipulation continue from mine.
Dealing with a narcissist in divorce;
My best advice and experience for someone in a divorce or still dealing with a narcissist ex-spouse is to NOT ENGAGE. They will do anything to drag you in or manipulate your feelings and thought processes. I found that the most painful thing to a narcissist is being IGNORED. Even when the lies start flying, IGNORE IT. Think about getting hit with a bat by a professional baseball player, that’s what it feels like to a narcissist when you ignore them. Comments will be made that will be hurtful, untruthful, and foremost demeaning. No matter what you do or how much want to be amicable, just forget it. With the lack of control that they no longer have of you, they hate you, and consider you their utmost enemy. Work on DETACHING from their world. Get it in your head, that they will NEVER change no matter what you do. All they want is for you to be continue to be their HOSTAGE.
Keep in mind, that even though their persona displays a hardcore tough exterior, they are truly weak people on the inside. For the most part in a divorce & post divorce, they will utilize their attorneys to attempt to regain control, and bully you to continue their abuse.
Lawyers & your settlement;
Your MSA (Marital Settlement Agreement) will be you future bible. It is one of the strongest binding contracts in the world. It will take and act of God to change it once its signed by a judge. DO NOT sign the MSA with language you cannot live with, even if you have to be the bad guy. The narcissist will pick it apart to find items that they can control and abuse you with later. Even when your divorce is over, it’s not over to them (especially with kids).
From the start, do not allow the lawyers to fight with each other. They don’t care and aren’t really fighting, its called posturing so they get your money. All the other rubbish that normally happens before the MSA is just a phony process to get to the same thing that’s gonna happen, a settlement sit down. Insist on proceeding with a settlement from the start and don’t back down from it. Its not going to be easy, but it will save a lot of money and emotion.
Take back your identity of who you are.
Enjoy,
Mr. Nice Guy
Mr. Nice Guy is correct. I worked in Family Law. Pleeeease find every nasty attorney and interview them Don’t HIRE THEM–just INTERVIEW them or someone in their firm. Your ex cannot hire them then–it would be a conflict of interest, unethical and punishable by the lawyers board of professional responsibility. Also, attorney’s do EXACTLY as Mr. NIce Guy says, they “Churn the File”–which means they charge and argue and charge just to settle, but THEY make money at a handsome hourly rate. I once worked on a case where the attorney’s were fueling a fight over who got the seven dollar “CandyLand” game. Be proactive. Keep track of the time you talk with your attorney–so many “guess” at the length of a conversation. DO NOT use your lawyer as a therapist. It is way too expensive and they have no training!! You attorney is a business relationship. Nothing more. Use it that way.
DO NOT ENGAGE with the ex, as the article says. That is easier said than done, but get help and learn how to disengage. I learned this, I did it, and it WORKED!
Great advise, my daughter has gone through this and since the ex has remarried a lawyer and they are now driving her mad with their using the child to control and abuse. It is now going through the courts and they play the ‘she’s mental’ card. Amazing that her mental health is intact after all the years with this man. Only advice is if you see a narcissist run like hell.
I agree with you Run like Hell . I hear this is getting more and more common these days. I am glad I raised my sons upstate NY…in the mountains. down to earth guys. My husband and I were raised like that. My brother whom I do not talk to that often was and is a narcissts. He went through a lot of women. He had a great business spent all his money on impressing woman, buying expensive jewelry, Rolex watches. Cars houses etc..NOW LOL LOL….he is sweeping in a grocery store and bagging food. He is losing his hair and his testesterone. LOL….I pray for him but no sympathy. A lot of women has ran from him Fast…Good girls…
My son married a Narcissist. She was spoiled as a child very bad from her mother’s side of the family. She has siblings but they were ignored. Anything she wanted she got. Her mother belittled her husband in front of her so she had no respect for men. Now 31 she is out of my son’s house. They are separted and trying for joint custody. She is the most obnoxious person I have ever met. She has shown me and my husband no respect. It is all about her. Forget the child and my son. I did not like her from the start, the goodness and Christianity in me tried to love her and her family. BUT I can not. She told me she should not have married my son. She should have married a richer man. She is physically a phoney with 3000.00 breast implants. Was wearing fake eyelashes. Phoney nails. 125.00 hair styles. over a thousand dollars of clothes.
165.00 sunglasses..She had a good job making megamoney..too bad she got layed off..too bad baby. She is living with a psychotic ex alcoholic that had her daughter taken away from her. The both of them are Narcissits. I pray my son finds a real live woman that loves him for what he is. I do not feel bad because my son is strong and I have a beautiful Grandaughter
I have been married to a narcissist for 4 years now. Before we got married he was a in knight in shining armor. He was so loving, helpful, empathic, respectful, and so much fun. As soon as we got married it all changed immediately. I guess now that he knew he had handcuffs on me he didn’t feel the need to act anymore. I started noticing something strange about certain things he would say, his viewpoint, his behaviors. How I would just simply disagree with him on something and he would rage and break things. How we would be love birds have a marital argument and then to him we were complete enemies. He showed no mercy on me when he would cheat or do something really hurtful. I would find out about it and confront him and he would rage against me as if I had done something to him! I couldn’t believe it! I always felt something was totally off about him so I started looking things up and I ran into narcissism and have read all about it. Since then it has gotten a lot worse. I see it in everything he does. The pain I feel is so deep and he doesn’t care. I eventually made the mistake of telling him I want a divorce. Since we are separated and haven’t lived with each other in years we have nothing to fight over. I even filed no-fault irreconciilble differences just so we won’t have to fight anything. All i want is my children but he continues to see this as a battle to be won…but what is the reward? My reward is the divorce itself. I tell him all the time that I am not trying to make him look bad that I am just trying to be happy. I cannot deal with his constant cheating, lying, and emotional abuse. He thinks of anything he can to try and tear me apart in court and make me look bad. He always talks about having the upperhand and such. He tells me it is so unfair that I get to get child support when I am the one who will have the children. He has even asked me will I still help him get on his feet. huh? After reading about NPD I see through everything that he does…even when he says something sweet and loving he sounds like the devil the day he deceived eve. It never sounds like he means it. He always tries to punish and hurt me for being mad at him for his abuse. He acts as if I am the one who is out of line for my ignorance and inconsideratness of his disorder. How dare I not be understanding to the fact that he needs all of these other women to make him feel better about himself? How dare I disagree with him or voice any concerns? How dare me?!!!! Its quite pathetic. I really would like to know how to get out of this marriage without having to deal this is rages and abuse. I wonder should I tell him I called it off and that I still want to be with him until court day? At this point I will manipulate, lie and deceive HIM to avoid going through his abuse and drama. Its like a game of whose high and whose low, whose superior over the other one and who has the most control or the upperhand. These things don’t even concern me but I am tired of being hurt and anxious because he feels the need to try and hurt be to feel like he has the upperhand. ARG somebody break these handcuffs!!!!!! I warn anybody he is reading this and thinks they are dealing with a N or feels confident and can’t leave to LEAVE!!!! You are not loved, cared about, respected, or even human to these individuals. You are just an intrument to be used in anyway to make them feel superior, godlike, loved, like, etc. They are feeding off of your soul. Draining the self-esteem out of you so they can use it for a while…
All I can say after reading the comments is WOW! It is simply amazing how all narcissist are EXACTLY alike. I feel as if we have all been with the same person.
I am not divorcing a narcissist, but I have ended a 10 year relationship with a narcissist and it is pure hell. We do have one child together and if it were not for my child I would be but a mere memory to this person because I would have left the relationship and the area even sooner and would have never tolerated any of his emotional abuse, temper tantrums and control. While I did not know what emotional abuse was because I had never experienced it in any other relationship, I always knew his behavior was not right and had know idea there was a pathology to it and how insidious it was. I saw a checklist on a show and he was a textbook example of a narcissist and that is when I began to see the light and gained a better understanding of what and who I was dealing with and began to take action. I definitely agree with Mr. Nice Guy with the advice not to engage the narcissist and have found this to be my greatest weapon. His hatred, insults and delusional accusations against me, mean nothing to me, because his opinion of me holds no weight whatsoever in my life at this point, so therefore nothing he says penetrates me. He can call me every name in the book and it means nothing to me, I give his words no power and that has allowed me to maintain my sanity, because otherwise he would have the power to push my buttons when he feels like it. I believe that once you realize what and who you are dealing with, you must imagine yourself in a real battle, because this person is indeed your mortal enemy and what is at stake is your happiness, your peace and serenity, and your sanity. Fight for it, because they want it and do not want you to have any of it, although it does belong to you, that’s how selfish they are.. They do not feel that you deserve to have your own happiness, if they even see a semblence of happiness coming from you, they want that too. My ex used to turn the music off or change the station, in the car when I would start to enjoy a song, that’s how little happiness he wanted me to have.
Plan, strategize, and be covert about everything. No warrior in a battle would ever let their enemy know their strategies or give them the exact time of an attack. I am doing so much work in the background and my ex does not know anything about it. The same reserve I used when I sat and listened to his insults, and temper tantrums is the same reserve I use now, I simply keep my mouth shut about everything and plan to be free of him. We thankfully do not live together anymore, but when we do have contact because of our child and he finds a way to always get some insults in, I ignore him and do not engage him and keep quiet and that is how I approaching everything concerning him. I won’t give him the satisfaction because that only keeps me on his level and I know for a fact that I am no where near on the same level that he is on. I am proud of myself for the strength I have developed having to go through this obstacle in life. I see me as strong and him as weak and because of that I know I will not only survive but THRIVE!
You are an inspiration. I am in the same situation and it is so hard. It hurts so much. Thanks for sharing.
Wish I had read this article before separating and then divorcing my narcissist ex-husband. I also experienced the wonderful person who treated me like a princess, and interacted with my son beautifully. Immediately after getting married, on our honeymoon, things began to change. Scary thing is… I stayed in this controlling relationship for 9 years much to the despair of my young son from a previous marriage. It always appeared that he was fair, but in reality he controlled all of the money, his power over me, because he had his own business and I did not sign on the account. With the support of my therapist and family I finally decided to move forward with the divorce. He is a financial planner, very savvy when it comes to money. I made the huge mistake of thinking he would do “the right thing”, as I had heard him tell so many people to do. His clients included my family members, friends I had before our relationship, and new close friends; so I never thought he would be so ruthless. It has been 4 years, my battle in court has been a joke. Anyone getting divorced, there is
ABSOLUTELY no justice in family law. Like Christie Brinkley says, she just wants to go on with her life. Fortunately I never had children with this person, but he was terrible to my son. I recently saw something on the news about a women whose husband was convicted of sexually assaulting her, is serving time for the crime, but because she made more money than him, she has to pay him spousal support after he is released.
This is SO wrong. My ex-husband had the money to go after me and I had nothing. In the end Mr. Financial Planner, (he calls himself The Plan Man), took both of our homes, 3 out of 4 cars, all the furniture in the home he ran his business out of, came and took the patio furniture I took when I moved out of our home. And at the very end, because I did not have enough money to go to trial, and I was so beaten down and exhausted, I even gave him my refrigerator AND I delivered it! Four years later and now I am being pursued by the IRS for our last tax return. BUT I no longer live in that oppressive environment with that selfish, controlling person. So sad it has taken so long to move forward. But it will happen!!
So sorry to hear this story. One suggestion I have, which I used, was to get the help of an Ombudsman for your IRS issues. You can google this and find out about who they are and what they can do to help you with the tax situation. There is no cost and they are not agents, which is good – they actually have a different kind of power. You get one through the IRS but they do not work for them. You are on the other side of the divorce – don’t look back. Enjoy the journey forward! Best, Ann
Thank you Bella, that means alot. It is indeed hard to leave a narcissist, but in my opinion once you have “seen the light” so to speak, it is even harder to stay with a narcissist. I would often ask myself, would I allow a complete stranger to treat me this way and of course the answer was no, so I began to accept the fact that essentially I already was dealing with a stranger anyway with the narcissist. Every time he pulled a new stunt, I could not believe what I was hearing and seeing, it was always as if I didn’t know him and who he was, so to me he became like a stranger. I know many women who stay in bad and/or abusive relationships and most often the reason for staying is “Because I love him” and now I cannot help but to ask even if under my breath, “But do you love yourself?” I realized I love me waaay more than I loved him and because I do love me, I wanted, needed and deserved better.
Thank you so much for writing this and to everyone else for their comments. I just saw Christie Brinkley do an interview on The Today Show about divorcing a narcissist. Until then, I though I was the only one going through this. Of course, we all share situations, so it is good to remind ourselves and each other that we are not alone. I used “the bad one” as my name because that is how he portrays me to everyone. If I claim that, then I am being “the victim”. If I fight, I’m “crazy”. So, I agree about nor engaging. The problem is that it is almost impossible not to engage when we coparent. Christie Brinkley said that her ex always pulls something when she has something good happen in her life. They are relentless in their vendetta. It is easy to get caught in the web. One key, I believe, is to try to stay calm and remain clear on what is real and what we are reacting to – ie when they are pushing our buttons. It is exhausting emotionally, and has even affected my health. They know that this “soft” abuse is difficult to litigate. You can check out an article I wrote right after our divorce on abuse in affluent communities. http://www.onesmartmother.com/pdf/birdinagildedcage.pdf
And thank you for writing and sharing your link. It provides a much needed perspective and a line to getting help. I encourage anyone reading this who feels there is no hope, to read it. Yes, coparenting can be misery that goes on and on. It is necessary to put it in perspective, focus on the goal and and as you wisely said, remain clear on what is real and what we are reacting to. Thanks much for writing and making a difference. Best, Ann
I just finished reading the comments above-I cannot believe the similarities that all narcissists have. I met my husband at a very young, impressionable age (13 years old) and he was my first and only boyfriend. He was great to me-until we married the year I graduated high school. Honest, it wasn’t 2 weeks after we married that he turned like a pit bull. It was “all of a sudden” my friends were bad influences…no good for me-but, unfortunately, I allowed him to control me. After our first son was born, he got crazy…I wasn’t allowed to work, he would take my car keys to work with him, he would take the phone with him…he would flip out and break our belongings if he got mad about something. I remember countless times he would break furniture or put his hand through windows when he was mad about something-it was awful. It was always ME who made him do those things. There wasn’t a wall in our house that didn’t have pictures or long mirrors up just to conceal the holes in the walls where he would bash them in. It was always, and continues to be, he’s the victim-why did I make him do those things? I would just let him go out, for weekends at a time, knowing he was with other women, just to have peace. I was lost-I had no self worth, isolated from my family—I had nowhere to turn. When our second son was born, he was disappointed that he wasn’t a girl, so he never really accepted him into his life-he wanted one of each, but we weren’t given that-so he chose to ignore the second child altogether. He completely controlled me-the finances, the decision making, even the grocery shopping-I wasn’t allowed to go to the market to grocery shop. My paychecks went in the joint account, to which I was given a $25 allowance per week to keep for me. I wasn’t allowed to see what was in the bank-it wasn’t my business-just be grateful your bills are paid-he paid everything. I should be grateful he is with such an ugly, fat person because without him, I wouldn’t have anything. The stories I could tell you, would blow your mind. It was New Year’s Eve, 1997, that my husband had another couple over for the evening to celebrate. I didnt drink, never did, I was the designated driver, so that was another use for me to be around. The other couple, to whom HER husband was another abusive person, caused a huge scene, stormed out of the house and left-which now left me there alone with my husband and kids…not good. My husband was a mess-drunk and being verbally abusive but finally went to bed. My oldest son was 6 and my youngest was 2 at the time. My son looked up at me and said, “mommy, can we please leave? Lets move to Florida-far away from daddy….”. That was it-I realized that I couldn’t live this life anymore so I planned my escape. In February 1998 I moved out of the house, with just the two boys and the clothes on our backs and never looked back. He wouldn’t let us have any of our belongings (they all mysteriously burned up in our garage which caught fire, on what day? our anniversary)…He forced my sons out of their daycare as the caretaker refused to deal with him anymore—refused to pay child support for over a year-wouldnt carry us on his health care-wouldn’t give me one of the 3 cars we had in the driveway, forget about the house—hahahaha…no, nothing. I went in front of the judge and told him I wanted nothing, not a thing, just get me out of this marriage. My husband made the mistake of saying where my lawyer could hear that he would NEVER grant me a divorce, he would fight over the salt and pepper shakers…so my lawyer told the judge and asked the judge to make him pay for the entire divorce if he didnt grant it, so he did…thank goodness. I went on to obtain two degrees and educate myself so I could be successful and raise my children without having to depend on anyone for help, to which I am proud to say my oldest son is graduating from college in May with his double bachelors in education and the other is finishing his junior year in high school this June, both honors students. Please know their dad did everything he could, and still does, to belittle his children as well-they are never happy unless they are benefitting in some way. So please realize it doesnt end with a divorce with a narcissit…he made that 15 years of my life a living hell—from the time with him to even now, 15 years AFTER we divorced, he still torments me whenever he gets the chance…drags me into court for nothing…gets things ordered just to do it then doesn’t follow through—just to have some kind of control-he belittles me and his kids-the boys have a very limited relationship with him because he is so self centered and hurtful—-it is all about him. My ex even went as far as posting on my son’s facebook a post that said, “stop bragging about how much fun your having off in college-I dont need you rubbing it in” can you imagine? A parent who is jealous of his own children? Please note he isnt paying one red cent towards this child’s education, mind you. On his 21st birthday, went right to court to have his obligation to pay child support stopped so he didnt have to assist with his son any longer. He never remarried; nobody would ever tolerate his behavior—yes, he has had relationships, mostly with women half his age and easily controlled (like I was) I hear even most of his immediate family has given up on him. He never participated with the kids growing up-if he didnt control it, he wanted no part of it. Never underestimate a narcissist – they never change, not 15 years after the divorce—-still the same person—just such hate in their hearts…I cried yesterday when I saw the interview with Christy Brinkley—I know what she means, to just want peace from the person….good luck to all who encounter one—run, run for your life, because if you dont, they will try to drain you of any life you have-they are not happy unless you are less successful than they are.
Best wishes-
Tam
Thanks for this incredible tale of your move from victim to conqueror. It is quite moving and heartfelt. I had to laugh at the comment about the salt and pepper shakers – it resonates with my own experience about wicker baskets – but also is a window into the world of the narcissist both sad and frightening. Your comeback to empowerment through education is one I hear at times – congratulations on this. Others find a way back in other ways – the important thing is reclaiming that life for yourself and moving on. Best, Ann
IGNORE. Mr. Nice Guy is correct. Ns will stop at nothing to get you. When the things that used to work no longer do, they will try something else. They will keep on trying, and things will get more and more outlandish and crazy. The accusations they make against you can be sooo hurtful, and beware anything you shared in your past will now be used against you. If you shared you were abused as a child, something at one time they were so sympathetic to (and they never were, they just pretended to be), they will now use that against you. “Oh, I understand why you are doing this. You were abused as a child, so you think it’s okay to hurt your own child. I understand. Let me help you get better so you can stop hurting your child” All this, of course, when you aren’t hurting your child. Whatever vulnerabilites you showed in the past, they will exploit when you get the courage to leave them. IGNORE no matter how difficult it is. This is important for two reasons – #1 – it drives them CRAZY, and #2, when and if you DO react, it gives them fuel to say YOU are the crazy one. My ex did this so many times and I’m ashamed of how many times I fell for it. He cheated repeatedly (always blaming me, he was sorry, but I was just so mean to him, he just needed a woman to be nice to him. I gained too much weight when I was pregnant and didn’t take care of myself, so what is a guy like him supposed to do? Don’t I realize how lucky I am to have him when hot women are always hitting on him? It went on and on…..) When I finally reacted and yelled at him, he recorded it and then went to the police, claiming I also hit him. It was insane. I’ve since learned to just IGNORE and it has helped me tremendously. My heart goes out to anyone in this situation. It’s been 5 years since I left, and I am sad to say it has not gotten any better. He’s angrier now than he was 5 years ago. I, however, am much better. I’ve built a great support system, have a great lawyer, and found strength I never thought I had. But I wasn’t able to get to this place until I learned to IGNORE.
Thank you for reminding us of the value of the IGNORE button. It is underused and under-appreciated for its intrinsic value in accomplishing the goal of freedom from the victimization of the narcissist. You used it wisely and your message is a good one – thanks for sharing it. Others need to hear what works and I’m happy you brought this up. Best, Ann
I too divorced an “N” and what a ride. It was a nightmare and still continues to this day. He uses his lawyer to make my life hell. He cares not of the $ wasted on ridiculous antics- only that he’s taking away from my quality of life and my bank account. We have 2 kids together and both of them are getting older and able to see more for themselves. There is a light at the end of the tunnel and I believe it’s my freedom to live my life as I choose. I’m happier now than I’ve ever been. It has been a hard road and at times I felt like I was never going to be free. He has said horrible things to the kids to berate me and make me look inadequate in their eyes. But ya know what? It hurts at first, sure but the kids see through positive actions and reinforcements on my behalf that no matter what- things will always be good and safe here with mom. Their dad can say whatever he wants about me but he will never take away the safe,happy, and secure environment I have created. Now, I get to close the door and he can never come in. That’s what pisses him off the most and that’s what I’ve gained. Freedom.
That’s exactly how I feel and where I am at now as well, he is not even welcomed in my home. Gone are the days when I felt obligated to make nice for his sake. I could not care less if he is offended. I don’t even want his energy in my home, because now IF we are around each other because of our child, I cannot wait to be rid of him and get away from him. I have all but removed myself from my child’s relationship with him, I do not protect him anymore and I do not make up excuses for him like I used to if he doesn’t follow through on something he promised to our child, I’m letting him reveal himself to our child for the person he really is.
Give Him Nothing
In terms of any type of reaction.
Everything that comes out of his mouth is a manipulation.
Everything has an agenda.
It may not make any sense to us, but somewhere down the line the agenda will become clear.
Trust Nothing he says.
I am going on 8 years divorced – 2 children – he has become like a science project.
Whatever he tells the kids – there is a reason – I try to figure it out ahead of time so I can spot the oncoming zinger that I know is out there, circling, waiting to strike.
It cushions the blow if you can spot it coming.
Knowledge is power.
I’m four years out from leaving and subsequently divorcing an incredibly abusive narcissist I was married to for 25 years. I wish I had known this type of support was out there at the time. It has been incredibly hard – and everything that is said in these prior posts are so true. I look forward to the day we don’t have to communicate about college tuition, alimony, the sale of an underwater house. My advice is to IGNORE him. Keep yourself SAFE. LOVE your children and provide emotional security for them. Don’t get lured into endless negotiations over all the things he wants to continue to control. BREAK THE CYCLE OF ABUSE. But most importantly, BE PROUD of yourself for making the break, choosing to live an authentic life. It does get better.
I am very happy to hear i am not alone. I divorced a narcissist and here we are 3 years later and he is still going strong with lawyers trying to take the kids from me. What i need some help with is this, i am always always shocked at the lies and antics this man pulls to destroy me, why cant he just let me be? He does something, usually with a lawyer or putting my kids in the middle, and i let it get to me! I feel like i can never relax and let my guard down because as soon as i do, he strikes again!
While you may not be able to let your guard down it is important to get in control of your emotions so you feel better. One thing I did that stopped my anxious moments immediately was to file a bar complaint against opposing counsel. While he was being investigated all bad actions stopped. He was deferential to me, did nothing for my husband, and it was a joy to watch him under the microscope. Find something that you have control over and it won’t make you feel so helpless. This feeling of power will translate to your feelings and behavior. It works – try it. Best, Ann
Thank all of you so much. I have been married for 35 years!!!! I have lived with a narcissist the entire time. I have been miserable the entire time. We have three grown children. I sought out counseling on and off for the entire marriage. Finally in 2000 my husband agreed to go with me to counseling. The very wise therapist, after meeting with him, shared with me that I was married to a narccisist. He was alway dissatified with me as a mother, wife, and sexual partner. He was unemotional to me and our children. He had told me in the beginning of our relationship that he always “worked every situation to his advantage.” I now know how true those words were and are. About four years ago he went online and put an ad out to have a dicreet fling. He met with one of the women and I found out about it. He blamed it all on me. I did not love him the way he loved me and he had to have meaningful conversation with someone who understood him. He always said I was crazy and I believed him and took all of the blame. He wanted the world to see him as a devoted husband, father, and christian. As things escalated in the past four years he tried to alienate me from our children, my family and friends. We own a business together and we hardly ever went to work. I am ashamed to say that I have done horrible things in an effort to save the marriage. He would encourage “lovingly” for me to share my soul, only to use everything against me. I even wrote a letter taking all of the blame that was never sent to family and friends. He brought the letter to court. He always provided and supplied materially to maintain control. He is now buying our youngest son who has turned against me. I left 6 times only to be sweet talked in to coming back. This too has all been used against me. He ordered me to send him sexually explicit tex messages to provide stimulation to him and he saved them and used them against me in court. Finally after two years of him pushing for us to have sex together with other people I said absolutely NO. It was that day that he told me not to come home. He wanted to give me nothing. I have wonderful friends who have taken me in. The alchohol abuse has been horrific. He came home one night and pushed me out of bed on the floor. After when abuse charges had been filed he used tex messages to say it was during rough sex. He spent 25K on trying to rub my nose in a lie. Narcissists will stop at nothing. I loved him and kept believing that it would change and that it was all my fault. NOW I KNOW THE TRUTH. He tells everyone that I am a liar. He actually lied under oath and admitted it to me. I told a therapist once that what I wanted in life was PEACE. Interesting that Christe Brinkley wants the same thing. I may walk away with nothing, but I have everything. Being FREE of someone with NPD is the greatest gift of all. I agree with all of you. Stop engaging. It took me a long time but I now understand. I will no longer be his Narcissitic Supply. My codependancy has ended. When you have time listen to a song by Whitney Houston “I didn’t know my own strength”, it really helps!!!! My heart and best wishes go out to all of you.
Thank you for this heartfelt message. I know I speak for many when I say it will make a difference to those who need to hear the words from one who has been there and acknowledged, recognized and felt by all. Best wishes, Ann
I would also STRONGLY suggest to anyone with child custody issues to use the ourfamilywizard.com website for communication. Our judge ordered us to use it, and it’s been a lifesaver. I’ve recommended it to others who’ve requsted it be a part of their custody orders as well. My order states we are ONLY to communicate via this website. My ex tries and tries to engage me in conversation whenever we cross paths, but I absolutely refuse to speak to him. I liteally pretend as if I am deaf and I don’t hear him. If he sends me a text message, I reply “please communicat with me via the OFW website” Prior to having this as part of our order, he’d try to engage me in conversation and then go to court and say that I said things I never said, or that he tried to engage in reasonable conversation with me and I yelled and did whatever else……. it has become clear now to our judge that this is not a “it takes two to tango” case, as the communication thorugh the website clearly shows differently. Also, if possible have exchanges occur at school, (one parent drops off, the other picks up, therefore you don’t have to see each other) and on non school days, or if your child is not yet in school, have them occur at a police station. Receiving party has to arrive 10 minutes before exchange and wait in lobby. Exchange occurs in lobby and party dropping off waits ten minutes before leaving. Sounds extreme, but it works. My ex previously followed me home after I picked my daugher up from him, got in front of me, turned around and took a picture with his cellphone, texted me and said “stop following me or I will go to the police” I dropped my daughter off at my sister’s house and immediately went back to the police station where sure enough, he’d just filed a police report stating I was following him. I gave the police my side of the story and left. At another exchange, I went to take my daughter from him, he held onto her, and wouldn’t let go. When I tugged at her, he screamed at the top of his lungs “OH MY GOD!!! DID YOU JUST RIP HER FROM MY ARMS??” Then followed me to my car asking why I was abusing our daughter. After this, he filed a motion citing these two instances and asking for custody. It backfired on him and the judge agreed to my request for the police station lobby exchange. He protested and the judge asked him why he wouldn’t agreee, it was the perfect solution since he claimed I was so crazy at exchanges and this protected everyone. Ns will stop at nothing to “get” something on you, so protect yourself in all ways possible. These are two things you can ask for up front that are easy to do, any maybe will spare you a court date or two.
Wow at the whole following you home, taking a picture of you and claiming YOU were following HIM, just wow! Thanks for the tips and insight.
Thanks so much to everyone who has left a comment here, and to Ms Bradley for this website, and the wonderful information. It REALLY helps to know that I am not crazy!
My ex – we have been divorced since 2001, and it still goes on and on. Last year I got a restraining order for verbal harrassment, which of course only made him attack me more – I am still afraid of him after all these years. Afraid of the retaliation if I would ever actually file a police report when he attacks me in some manner. Our daughter is 14, and in the past 4 years – He uses her as an excuse to attack me, because that is the only contact that I have with him. He has been an mostly absent Dad seeing our daughter only a few times a month. My daughter loves me, but she is not above manipulating things with her Dad to get what she wants (even his attention). If I get angry with my Daughter – and send her to her room for example – She calls her Dad who then calls the police on me. There are lots of examples like this – it has been THE WORST – I know all about his narcisstic behaviour and can predict his reaction. But it has been so painful for me – that my daughter knows what her dad will do to me, and yet to get her way, she ‘tells’ on me if I give her a punishment (like being grounded), or if I tell her ‘No, you cant do that” like go to the mall, etc. She even hates her dad too, most of the time – but He pays attention to her when she is angry with me. The thing about a Narcisstic relationship – besides the crazy abuse – It is a loss of personal power, and feeling that you have no control over your life, because you never know what is around the corner.
I’ve written you recently regarding your Victim sight and was very impressed and happy you answered me right away. Unfortunately, my daughter’s narcissist abuser has hired a shark of a lawyer (woman), and almost daily my daughter receives letters from the lawyer with threats (they call them offers), the narcissist sends her e-mails at work and text messages her endlessly. This narcissist has spent most of his time on all the social networks, however we live in a no-fault state. He has taught their six-year-old how to use an i-phone and video games to distraction so when my daughter and we have him we are patient and do our best to get him to the park, play ball, be with other kids, etc. to show him there is more to life than just those games. My grandson has also told me he has three mommies! I told him he has only one mommy and that is my daughter. This narcissist is demanding fifty-percent parenting time (which they are in a trial period ). This is upsetting to all of us to think a person with such controlling, etc., ways would have a beautiful child fifty percent of the time. And, this narcissist is acting cockier all the time saying the child is happier with his parents not together. Daddy-dearest goes away on trips and brings back gifts for the child, and when he speaks to the child he should get the Academy Award for Best Actor in the category of “Father.” Oh, my son, my son, etc. He (the narcissist) also uses Christianity to hide behind. The Lord wants him to do this; look what good I’ve done, the Lord has spoken to me and this is the path I must take. At one point a short time ago, my daughter weakened mainly because of the child and tried to reconcile, the narcissist told her he had moved on and made a flowery speech leaving his ring behind. Two days later she found out why he moved on – another woman. Of course, another victim. We have told her NOT to engage with this man except for the child, and she did. Well, the narcisist got her right where he wanted her. And, he was merciless. Told her he could use the “reconciliation” against her in court, BUT his heart told him not to. Told her she always put the child before him while they were married, etc., etc., etc. I knew he was jealous of the child when he was born. NOW he wants to take this beautiful child away from his mother for 50 percent of the time. This child has special needs which my daughter has provided for him from the beginning. This man is cruel. Also, he has told everyone he can that it is my daughter who wants this divorce even though they have a young child and all he ever wanted was for the marriage to work. Reality check here: He was always giving my daughter ultimatums, so the last one she chose to get a divorce (at this point she was getting over being physically ill). He agreed to file jointly, but then opted to not go that route thereby making her the petitioner. There isn’t room here nor will I waste anymore space on this person except to say that he even had my husband and I fooled for quite a long time. He’s tried his nasty control on us, but we won’t be a part of any it and ignore him, so when he can he says untruthful things about us – and we treated him like a son for 18 years. I know you’ve heard it all, Ann, but if you have any suggestions, they’d be appreciated. How do we (my daughter, husband, me) handle any future contact before/after divorce with this narcissist. The narcissist wants to be “friends” and have everything amicable; at one point even said he wanted me to still cook him meals. True, but at least I can laugh at that. As I said before, my husband and I have no communication with him. It is my daughter who is very concerned because of the child. Thanks again, Betty
Hi Betty,
This is a most difficult time. I understand your daughter is emotional but the one thing she must do right now is keep her emotions under control so he doesn’t come across looking like the most normal thing on the planet when he isn’t. If your daughter is seeing custody evaluators or has to talk to them learn what they want to hear. They do not want her to tell them he is a narcissist or has any other personality disorder. They know she isn’t qualified to diagnose and will think she is a revengeful wife of a concerned spouse and she’s trying for control. He’ll come across looking good. She needs to say things such as, “Yes, children need both parents.” Show a willingness to co-parent. THEN, if you have something negative to say it will be much better received. But even then, keep it moderate at best. The courts do not like complaining parents. They think it shows the other in a better light. No, this isn’t fair. Don’t expect fair. This is a great book for times like this – written by an attorney about divorcing a spouse with a personality disorder – SPLITTING by Wm. Eddy
Also, try googling protective parents and divorce. See what you can come up with.
It wouldn’t hurt to do a little games playing yourself – go ahead and spoil your grandchild a bit here. Nothing wrong with leveling the playing field. You may have to play some games to not get kicked out and on the sidelines. If he isn’t playing fair, all bets are off. Nothing illegal with the judicial or legal system – I never advocate that, just a little bit of making yourselves look like the fun people too as he is doing. Your daughter needs all the help she can get, and being overly strict right now with grandchild may not help. Let him have fun, laugh, enjoy life and feel comfortable. This will go a long way. Best, Ann
Thank you once again, Ann. I guess none of us in this particular situation are expecting fair which is what scares me. I am passing this information on to my daughter immediately. Also, will check out the book you suggested. And, we will continue to have fun with and enjoy our grandchild!!!!! Wish you the best with your work and your life!!! Betty
I was just reading all the blogs and its so ironic…if only they fought for their marriage like they do in divorce. Such jerks